Read the Gospels: JC is not PC

By John MacArthurPastor, author Let’s be brutally honest: most of Jesus’ teaching is completely out of sync with the mores … Continued

By John MacArthur
Pastor, author

Let’s be brutally honest: most of Jesus’ teaching is completely out of sync with the mores that dominate our culture.

I’m talking, of course, about the Jesus we encounter in Scripture, not the always-gentle, never-stern, über-lenient coloring-book character who exists only in the popular imagination. The real Jesus was no domesticated clergyman with a starched collar and genteel manners; he was a bold, uncompromising Prophet who regularly challenged the canons of political correctness.

Consider the account of Jesus’ public ministry given in the New Testament. The first word of his first sermon was “Repent!”–a theme that was no more welcome and no less strident-sounding than it is today. The first act of his public ministry touched off a small riot. He made a whip of cords and chased money-changers and animal merchants off the Temple grounds. That initiated a three-year-long conflict with society’s most distinguished religious leaders. They ultimately handed him over to Roman authorities for crucifixion while crowds of lay people cheered them on.

Jesus was pointedly, deliberately, and dogmatically counter-cultural in almost every way. No wonder the religious and academic aristocracy of his generation were so hostile to him.

Would Jesus receive a warmer welcome from world religious leaders, the media elite, or the political gentry today? Anyone who has seriously considered the New Testament knows very well that he would not. Our culture is devoted to pluralism and tolerance; contemptuous of all absolute or exclusive truth-claims; convinced that self-love is the greatest love of all; satisfied that most people are fundamentally good; and desperately wanting to believe that each of us is endowed with a spark of divinity.

Against such a culture Jesus’ message strikes every discordant note.

Check the biblical record. Jesus’ words were full of hard demands and stern warnings. He said, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me. For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will save it. For what profit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and is himself destroyed or lost?” (Luke 9:23-25). “If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple” (Luke 14:26).

At one point an unthinkable Roman atrocity took the lives of many Galilean pilgrims who had come to worship in Jerusalem. Pilate, the Roman governor, ordered his men to murder some worshipers and then mingled their blood with the sacrifices they were offering. While the city was still reeling from that awful disaster, a tower fell in the nearby district of Siloam and instantly snuffed out eighteen more lives.

Asked about these back-to-back tragedies, Jesus said, “Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered such things? I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish” (Luke 13:2-5).

Ignoring the normal rules of taste, tact, and diplomacy, Jesus in effect declared that all his listeners were sinners in need of redemption. Then, as now, that message was virtually guaranteed to offend many–perhaps most–of Jesus’ audience.

Those with no sense of personal guilt–including the vast majority of religious leaders–were of course immediately offended. They were convinced they were good enough to merit God’s favor. Who was this man to summon them to repentance? They turned away in angry unbelief.

The only ones not offended were those who already sensed their guilt and were crushed under the weight of its burden. Unhindered by indignation or self-righteousness, they could hear the hope implicit in Jesus’ words. For them, the repeated phrase “unless you repent” pointed the way to redemption.

Elsewhere, Jesus made the promise of life and forgiveness explicit: “He who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life” (John 5:24). “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand” (John 10:27-28).

That, of course, is the glorious message of the gospel, just as potent and just as relevant today as it was then. But the promise is for those who are weary of sin; those who hunger and thirst for righteousness (Matthew 5:6); those who come to Christ with repentant heartsCnot those who are convinced they are fundamentally good.

Proud people, including lots of religious people who call themselves Christians, don’t really believe Christ’s message at all. He said, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance” (Mark 2:17).

So what would Jesus say to a pluralistic, tolerant, self-indulgent society like ours? I’m convinced his approach today would be the very same strategy we see in the New Testament. To smug, self-satisfied, arrogant sinners (including multitudes on church rolls) his words would sound harsh, shocking, provocative. But to “the poor in spirit” (Matthew 5:3)–those who are exhausted and spent by the ravages of sin; desperate for forgiveness and without any hope of atoning for their own sin–Jesus’ call to repentant faith remains the very gateway to eternal life.

This is a particularly hard message in cultures like ours that elevate self-love, self-esteem, or self-righteousness, but Jesus was absolutely clear, and these words do still speak to us: “Everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted” (Luke 18:14).

Dr. John MacArthur, pastor of 7,000-member Grace Community Church in Southern California, is a best-selling author of more than 200 books and study guides. His new book is “The Jesus You Can’t Ignore: What You Must Learn from the Bold Confrontations of Christ.”

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  • ender2

    The Rev is spot on. The christ created by Constantine and fleshed out by the ‘gospels’ written by the early Catholic church was designed as a tool to maintain power over the masses. While holding the keys to “salvation” the Jesus myth still spoke enough like the old testament tribal God of the warlord Abraham to be useful in drumming up the sheeples to a warlike frenzy against the enemy of whatever Crown was in power. To quote Joseph Stalin, “Convictions change but fear remains.” If the god of Abraham were real, and Jesus was really his incarnate self, I’d have to join the other side because they are patently evil.

  • globalone

    Amen.The idea that Jesus was simply a hippie, flower child who only preached about peace and love couldn’t be farther from the truth.Jesus commands us to judge one another and to hold each other accountable.

  • Raulemir

    Bingo. It’s great to see someone let Jesus speak for Himself through the Scriptures, rather than projecting modern PC jargon onto Him as if He were a first-century incarnation of a liberal Democrat.

  • mayoungkin

    Yet another example why, if there were a Mount Rushmore of contemporary Christian leaders, MacArthur would be on it. I am mildly surprised, but pleased, that the Post ran this.

  • Jimbobfunny

    Excellent summary of our current cultural condition. If you want a lot more detail in this same vein, read “Christless Christianity” by Michael Horton. It is a scary, but straightforward analysis of our culture.

  • davecardot

    The relevance, clarity and laser-beam commentary of John MacArthur’s article JC is not PC could not have appeared in a more pertinent publication. I would only hope that members of Congress, Judicial, and Executive Branch would read and ponder the power and wisdom of the Gospels. Of course this is just as counter-culture today as it was when the world was turned upside down by the Scriptural Jesus. He convicted the politically correct culture to the point that they crucified Him. I wonder if it would be any different today.

  • iamweaver

    Ah, but that’s only half of Jesus’ message. Without the second half, the kingdom of God would not be visible upon the earth.It does no good to repent if you don’t follow Christ. If Christ is indeed living in you, then you should be out there on the streets, visiting those in prison, or assisting those most in need, or befriending the homeless or an elderly neighbor, etc. If you’re just warming a pew, or even teaching Sunday School or serving on a church committee, then you might want to ponder what road you’re following. Don’t be afraid to take that step – God will equip you.We are called to spread the Good News – and that’s not necessarily standing on a street corner quoting scripture…

  • rohitcuny

    “Let’s be brutally honest:” Brutal? Yes. Honest? I am not sure.”The real Jesus was no domesticated clergyman with a starched collar and genteel manners; he was a bold, uncompromising Prophet who regularly challenged the canons of political correctness.” But political correctness did not really exist in his time. It is YOUR enemy, I can see that. I see no evidence in what you have written that it was his. When Jesus took up his whip it was to punish the religious conservatives of his time – he did not seek to whip Gandhi or John Lennon.Ultimately, you want your listeners to return to a harsh intolerant Christianity with which, apparently, some of the posters are in sympathy. But the truth is that we are all living in a difficult world, none of us is perfect, but neither are we all doomed to perdition unless we follow the harsh ways you are promoting in the name of Jesus.Mr. MacArthur, other religions beside yours exist and many of them have a lot of wisdom. Wake up and open your eyes. Don’t ask us to return to the harsh worldview of “My religion is the only real one and if you don’t follow it you will go to hell.” Or perhaps you WILL ask because that is your nature. But hopefully, most of America will ignore you.

  • rohitcuny

    Gandhi was a saintly man who swore that he would only wear a loincloth as long as his countryment were poor. He did preach love and tolerance, but he also preached self-restraint and discipline. He honored Christianity and Islam and regularly read from the Bible and the Koran at his prayer meetings. But through his life he retained the Hinduism which he had learned from his mother’s devotion and his father’s uncompromising honesty.And what would you have to say about him. I know Christians who believe that Gandhi must have gone to hell because he did not take Jesus to be his saviour. Gandhi’s teacher was the Krishna of the Bhagavadgita from whom Gandhi derived the message of karmayoga, doing good works without thought of reward.And what do YOU think about him? Did he go to hell? I agree that we all need to examine our hearts, do the good that we can and care for others. But to do that, we do not need the “brand name” of any religion. God lives in many a human heart, some of them Christian, and some not.

  • marieburns

    The good pastor has his facts right but his general interpretation wrong. Jesus was primarily a political leader fighting an oppressive elite comprised of the Roman overlords & their quisling Jewish priestly class. Jesus had a completely free public healthcare system which didn’t discriminate against rich or poor (you might call them miracles!), he deplored the concentration of wealth in the urban elite which left the peasants destitute, he said homosexuality was completely normal but he deplored divorce because women were its victims (Jesus was a flaming feminist by the standards of his day), he repeatedly said humans were incapable of judging others, and although he liked to have fun, he urged serious people to divest themselves of their wealth and pursue a life of public service. But he was no democrat. Despite the fact that both the Greeks & Romans had provided models for a form of democracy, Jesus favored a theocracy with his dim-witted disciples as the ruling council.As for repentance, that was a means to RELIEVE the Jews of the unnecessary & debilitating guilt they felt at breaking the myraid Pharisaic laws that forbade normal activities (like combing your hair on the Sabbath or plucking grain for a snack). Repentance wasn’t so much a warning to “sinners” as it was Jesus’ mental health plan — free services there, too. The Constant Weader at http://www.RealityChex.com

  • coloradodog

    “…pluralism and tolerance” BAD! JESUS SAYS SO.”elitism and intolerance” GOOD! ESPECIALLY IF YOU’RE GETTING RICH RUNNING A 7,000 MEMBER MEGA CHURCH.If I were Jesus, I would change my last name because of the image these Pharisees have made it into.Huckabees like MacArthur hate the words tolerance and diversity as evil hates the light.

  • coloradodog

    Well, I used to tell everybody that my religion was “Jesus is the best teacher and one only needs his words of love and inclusion” but now I’m glad MacArthur set me straight with his clarification that Jesus was nothing more than another punitive, intolerant follower of the small and shallow God of Abraham. Bye, Jesus, I’ll miss you.

  • johncarlson10

    The pastor’s message is most certainly not gospel, i.e.”good news”. By selectively pulling texts out of context Pastor MacArthur creates a stern, demanding, and unforgiving Jesus, quite unlike the Jesus one finds upon reading the Gospels. Ironically, in trying to create this image of Jesus, the pastor quotes two verses that let Jesus’s true nature shine through: “He who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life” (John 5:24). “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand” (John 10:27-28).There is the loving, compassionate, and forgiving Jesus that Pastor MacArthur thinks only exists in coloring books.

  • johncarlson10

    The pastor’s message is most certainly not gospel, i.e.”good news”. By selectively pulling texts out of context Pastor MacArthur creates a stern, demanding, and unforgiving Jesus, quite unlike the Jesus one finds upon reading the Gospels. Ironically, in trying to create this image of Jesus, the pastor quotes two verses that let Jesus’s true nature shine through: “He who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life” (John 5:24). “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand” (John 10:27-28).There is the loving, compassionate, and forgiving Jesus that Pastor MacArthur thinks only exists in coloring books.

  • coloradodog

    Huckabee MacArthur needs to read and reflect on Isaiah 5:20 one more time.

  • Counterww

    What most of the liberal posters here miss is that although Jesus did preach social justice, he also holds us accountable for the FACT that we are all sinners and that ultimately we have to confront the cross where Jesus died and his bodily resurrection that conquered this sin. COLORADODOG- you can sit there and pick and choose the scriptures you read. Yes, the OT has the stern God described. But Christ came to show his LOVE for us all by what he said and did. He would not have died and went through the anguish he did if we did not need it, ALL of us being sinner. McArthur describes the God that came and gave us a way out, but Jesus does require us to repent from sin and turn from our evil ways. You appear to not want to confront your own sin and act like you won’t be held accountable. We all will, but Christ it the conduit by which we can approach God and not be afraid.Your problem is that you don’t have a healthy respect or fear of God therefore you think that the preaching of Mcarthur is pointless. Better read up, you have it all wrong.

  • mammyyel

    Not to forget that it is cultures like this that lead many to find themselves “standing in need,” the very same need, identical to the immediate need of each and every one, including those who have availed themselves of saving grace. We don’t get meritorious ’cause we get saved. Minister in the fields ready for harvest, instead of trying to make the fields all pretty to suit your liking.

  • edallan

    Yes, Jesus was in many MANY ways counter-cultural to the “compassionate” “conservative” “born-again” “Christians” that Mr. MacArthur represents, and many of his own cherry-picked selections clearly document this. The scourging of the money-changers, for example, was clearly an attack, both physical and moral, against the unjust enrichment and “greed is good” politically correct codes of immorality espoused by MacArthur’s friends and funders in the Republican Party. (Politically correct — well, we DID have 20 years of Reagan-Bush-Bush.)Mr. MacArthur would do well to reread Matthew 25 and consider Jesus’ likely attitudes towards people who saw no issues at all with respect to taking food and heat and medicine from the poor and the elderly in order to give tax cuts to the super-rich and the incredibly rich. Matthew 25The Sheep and the Goats 34″Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’ 37″Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’ 40″The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.’ 41″Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ 44″They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ 45″He will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ 46″Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

  • ThomasBaum

    globaloneYou wrote, “Jesus commands us to judge one another”Didn’t he say, “Judge not lest ye be judged” and also, “He who is without sin, cast the first stone”.Jesus said, “We are to pick up our cross and follow Him”, He did not say, ‘That we are to jump on someone else’s cross and let them drag us’.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    iamweaverYou wrote, “We are called to spread the Good News – and that’s not necessarily standing on a street corner quoting scripture…”If the “Good News” is not ultimately for everyone than it is not “Good News” at all but ‘good enough news’ for some.When people take only part of Jesus’s Message, no matter what part that is, then the message can very well be twisted into something that it is not.It can be rather disheartening that what Jesus was talking about was God’s Love for us and the fact that God was reconciling Himself to us by HIS Actions and that God was extending His Invitation to us to be active participants in that Reconciliation with ALL OF HUMANITY and we can’t seem to take Jesus at His Word.On the cross, Jesus said, “It is finished” which translated is “PAID IN FULL”.This was and is God’s Way of letting us know that the Victory is total as in: God wins, satan loses, a tie is unacceptable.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ender2

    Well, we can’t talk about a ‘historical Jesus’ because he doesn’t exist. The only shred of direct evidence, the only thing written while he supposedly walked the earth was a one liner that mentions a radical rabbi named Jesus was written by Joseph of Aramathea.Other than that your Jesus was a camil. A horse put together by a committee. You can all be right about the Biblical Jesus because the Bible contradicts itself about every detail of his life and even his message. Just like the brutal god of Abraham, he was created in man’s image and so is capable of all of the good and bad you attribute to him. Stop wasting your time on ancient tribal superstitions and do something good for the world. Hoping a myth can make it where you don’t have to pay for being mean or stupid is illogical and would deprive you of much needed lessons.

  • ThomasBaum

    Counterww You wrote, “We all will, but Christ it the conduit by which we can approach God and not be afraid.”Jesus did NOT say, ‘No one comes to God except thru Me”, what He said was, “No one comes to the FATHER except thru Me”, there is a world of difference, so to speak, between those two statements.By the way “Christ” is not Jesus’s Name, it is a title. “Christ” does not mean God, it means “Anointed”.Jesus became the Son of God at the instant that He became the Son of Man and that is at the Incarnation when Mary said Yes.Before that He was God, after that He was God and Man not God-man but both completely.Have you ever met Dad? Jesus, Himself, said that we could refer to the Father as Abba which translates as Dad or Daddy.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • Mortal

    Wow. It’s not often that I read something that so misrepresents the Gospel as this piece by MacArthur. And he’s suppposed to be a “Christian leader”? God help us.Just as Jesus has a perfect right to state “I am the way”, or “the Father and I are one”, while I do not, He also can (and will) judge whomever and whatever He pleases – I (and MacArthur) most certainly DO NOT. It is our duty to be as inclusive and understanding as possible – it is not our place to pretend that we are “the judge of all the world”.Sorry, but the real Jesus we encounter in scripture is in no way this travesty MacArthur has dreamed up out of whole cloth.

  • andersbranderud

    You write> “Elsewhere, Jesus made the promise of life and forgiveness explicit: “He who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life” (John 5:24). “How to live in order to enable the Creator in His loving kindness to provide His kipur –atonement- is outlined in Tan’’kh ; and was also taught by Ribi Yehoshua. Ribi Yehoshua (the Mashiakh; the Messiah) from Nazareth taught in accordance with Tan’’kh the only way to get connection with the Creator, This way is found both in Torah and in Ribi Yehoshuas teachings found in our website – http://www.netzarim.co.il Anders Branderud

  • CKTK4HIM

    John MacArthur is right on target…for him.

  • Counterww

    Baum, Generally agree with you, but your theology is off.Jesus the son existed before he became a man. If you don’t know that, you need to re-read the NTGod is evident in three persons- Father, Son and Holy Spirit.When i said God in my previous post, it was omitting God the Father.

  • coloradodog

    COUNTERWW pontificates:COLORADODOG- you can sit there and pick and choose the scriptures you read. Yes, the OT has the stern God described. But Christ came to show his LOVE for us all by what he said and did. He would not have died and went through the anguish he did if we did not need it, ALL of us being sinner. McArthur describes the God that came and gave us a way out, but Jesus does require us to repent from sin and turn from our evil ways. You appear to not want to confront your own sin and act like you won’t be held accountable. We all will, but Christ it the conduit by which we can approach God and not be afraid.Your problem is that you don’t have a healthy respect or fear of God therefore you think that the preaching of Mcarthur is pointless. Better read up, you have it all wrong._____________________________Oooooogaaaah Booooogahhh!COUNTERWW’s small and shallow Abrahamic god in gonna getcha.These Hukabees have read my mind and decided that I don’t recognize my “sins’ and I am not sorry for them. And they ASSume I don’t respect God. I don’t have to “fear” my God. If your God is a “God of Love” why do you have to fear IT?You worry about you and I’ll worry about me. I’m at peace with my God but you have to shove yours down the throats of others to justify your insecurity like Mormons repeating a hypnotic mamtra in Testimony Meeting: “Yes, I know this is true.”Although Jesus taught you not to judge others, you’re bound and determined to do it anyway because, in your little pea brain like Sarah Palin, you believe “God is on your side” and you’re right and anyone else is wrong. What if you’re do for a rude awakening when you meet your maker for your hate and exclusion of others? But I don’t believe this because that’s not a characteristic of my God of unconditional love.I look forward to meeting you in the great beyond to determine if love triumphs over your hatred and exclusion. See you there.

  • Counterww

    Coloradodog- The part you don’t get, is that God calls all to eat as his table. You have part of it right but it does NOT mean that you can not repent. Jesus made this plain in his preaching in that those that know more, are accountable for their actions more than those that never hear about his gospel. You attempt to hold the God of the Bible to some Abrahamic paradigm when Jesus came with the new convenent (sp) and said that all came come to him to have their sins forgiven through the atoning blood on the cross and his conquering it through the resurrection. This is what Paul explains in the letters. Fear of God means RESPECT of God, a reverence for God, nothing more.By the way, your calling me “pea brained” means nothing. God, and Jesus , is on the side of humanity. He died on the cross for YOU and all people no matter what their political persuasion. It is not about politics, it is about YOUR personal relationship with God and what you will say to him when you have to confront him upon death. Will the ransom of Jesus on the cross pay for your sin, or will your lack of giving up self result in God denying your entrance into the kingdom? Politics has NOTHING to do with this, and you are making it a straw man and letting what others believe about Republican versus Democrat distract you from the truth of the gospel.Read through the gospels and especially Romans and you will understand . Open minded reading that is.

  • mbeck1

    “If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple” (Luke 14:26).I guess Jesus wasn’t a big family man.

  • CalSailor

    I read Dr McArthur’s words several times; what I found is what Lutherans consider law, not gospel. It is the key to Martin Luther’s understanding of the biblical message. In the Lutheran understanding of law, we mean a word from scripture, [which is understood as the Word of God--the revelation of Christ, who is the Word--] which convicts us of sin. That is, whatever tells us that no matter what we do, what we believe, how we act, we are unable to save ourselves. This means that we have NO ability to earn our salvation. That includes repenting–we cannot even repent enough. Every part of scripture that knocks us back down and says: you’ve failed. You can’t get there. You aren’t good enough is law.The bible contains law even in the gospels. Much of what Jesus said is law; even what is clled the Sermon on the Mount, because we cannot live up to the demand. We cannot repent sufficiently. We cannot believe sufficiently.So, what is the purpose of the law? Ultimately, to drive us to the gospel. That is, to constantly let us know we cannot live up to the demands of God, for God is perfect, and we will never BE perfect. It is to tell us that WE cannot do/be/believe enough, perfectly enough, etc. And to one who has heard the law, then the gospel comes in and says: but the real good news is that YOU don’t have to. God already has. Paul talks in Romans about the utter inability we have to do it ourselves. In the first chapter, he states that he is not ashamed of the gospel for it is the power of God for those who believe, but then, he lets us know that even faith is a gift. Romans chapters 1-4 point out the basis of our relationship with God: Forgiveness granted to us through Christ. Yet, that forgiveness is given to us as a gift. And a gift is NOT earned; it is free. Otherwise, it would be a wage, not a gift. The distinction between law and gospel is essential as the central paradox, if you will, of faith in Christ: every time we start believing that we have done something, the law comes to drive us back to the gospel, literally the “good news” that we don’t need to. God has already done it.Many people quote John 3:16: For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever belives in him shall not perish but have life everlasting. But too many people miss the first six words, which are key to understanding the entire verse: For God so loved the world… What this verse says is that the love of God for his world is not subsequent to Christ’s coming, nor dependent upon how it receives him, but he loves it absolutely and unconditionally. That’s the real gospel. To believe that we participate in that redemption in some way is the sneaky way we keep trying to insert ourselves somehow in the redemption…and we cannot.[The greatest demonstration of how we keep putting ourselves into the picture as somehow contributing, is the current discussion of the Rapture. Because, when you parse it completely, it says that somehow, WE can help trigger the situations that bring on the end of the world. Somehow WE help "finish" the work of redemption. If Israel MUST regain its lands, or be restored, then WE must somehow be an agent of the end. Othewise, WHY must it be restored? Cannot God end the world whenever he wants? What do OUR actions need to be to make it happen? Actually, nothing?]When I teach confirmation classes, one of the key documents I make the students learn is the meaning of the key faith statements, including the 10 commandments, the Lord’s Prayer and the Apostles Creed. Martin Luther wrote explanations for student use. For the explanation to the last part of the Apostles Creed, Luther wrote:I believe that I cannot, by my own reason or strength, believe in Jesus, OR COME TO HIM, but instead the Holy Spirit (ie, God) has called me through the gospel, enlightened me with his gifts, made me holy and kept me in faith, just as he calls, gathers, enlightens, and keeps holy the entire church and keeps it in the true faith. Daily he forgives me and all believers from all sin. On the last day, he will raise me and all believers, and grant us eternal life.Law and gospel are irreparably joined in a true understanding of the faith. One without the other is incomplete. I agree with Dr McArthur that the tendency of too many in the church today is to forget that there is a law aspect of the message of Jesus. But the reality is that law, apart from gospel, only drives people to despair. I think some of the gospel is missing from his article.Pr Chris

  • warrenoff

    Truth is so obscrue in these times and falsehood so established,that unless we love the truth, we cannot know it( Blaise PASCAL 1621-1661)(quote of scripture addes) All Scripture is inspired of God and is profitable for teaching, reproof, correction and instruction in righteousness so the man may be complete throughly equipped for every good work.)

  • warrenoff

    1 corinthians 2:10-16) But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of a man which in in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have recieved not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit of God. that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spritual.14 But natural mind does not recieve tha things ogf the Spirit of God, for thay are foolishness to him; nor can he know them because they are spiritually discerned(dead).15 But he who is spiritual judges all things,yet he himself is rightly judged by no one.16 For who has knowen the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him? but we have the mind of Christ. look at Romans 13 1:7(Submit to Government related scripture Ex 1:17,dan 3;16-18.6:7-10,Governing authorties 1 thes 4,11,12, 1 tim 2;1-2,titus 3;1-2, no authority except from God Psalms 66;11 , 103;19, 1 TIM 6;15) keeping a clear conscience before Him(God)2 Corinthains 1:12) Taxes-Matt22;17.21 ) Jesus an exzample of paying temple tax MATT 17 ;24-27. scripture is so clear when you surrender your life to God through His son Jesus and when you truely genuine come to faith, repentance and belief, the third part of the trinty the Holy Spirit will reveal Scripture to you , Problem in our world is people dont read and reason.pray that you wil let Jesus and His word guide you in truth and salvation to eternity and keep you from a real Hell. the Bilbe is a very real warningof who we really are(Jeremaih 17:9-10) The heart is decietful above all things.And desperatly wicked; Who can know it?I the Lord .searches the heart, I test the mind, Even to give every man according to his ways, According to the fruit of his doings.

  • rohitcuny

    Religious conservatives do not understand that Jesus was not God. God would not have allowed himself to be crucified. Since Jesus WAS crucified, an elaborate story has to be invented as to how his death fitted into some divine scheme whereby he could atone for all of mankind’s sins, including the wholly imaginary sins of humans who were not yet born in his time, and the sins of people who had already died before he was born. These strange logical contortions which Christianity had to go through have distracted Christians from the actual message of Jesus who was a wise man, but not perfect, and not God. The Christian stance puzzles Muslims who wonder how Christians who consider themelves monotheists can believe at the same time in the Trinity.Liberals make a similar mistake with Jefferson who is often presented as if he was perfect and as if he wrote the constitution all by himself. In fact we all know that he owned slaves. There is a pretense that even though he did own slaves, he would have endorsed a woman’s right to have an abortion!Once we face the fact that neither man was divine and neither man was perfect, there still remains our sense that morality is something real and not something imaginary. I do think that morality is real, but I do not need to invent perfect or divine men in order to take moral orders from them. I will listen to great men with respect, but I will also use my own common sense and my own sense of what is moral. I do not consider myself a “final arbiter”, but neither are they.

  • coloradodog

    Pr Chris wrote:”When I teach confirmation classes, one of the key documents I make the students learn is the meaning of the key faith statements, including the 10 commandments, the Lord’s Prayer and the Apostles Creed.”I remember these vividly from my Lutheran confirmation. What I don’t remember (except from the intolerant Utah Mormons and the Baptists on my Mom’s side of the family) was the constant judging and condemning others who didn’t fall exactly in line with their beliefs and their cherry-picking of scriptures to justify their intolerance.Although the Lutheran Church drove me away from organized denominations when I went away to college and was denied communion by the only Lutheran Church in town because they were Missouri Synod and I was not, I remembered and tried to obey the 10 Commandments and what was right and wrong and tried to emulate the Love of Jesus. Like all mortals, I failed with some of this by my “sins” which originally came from “missing the mark” in archery. I acknowledge, admit and ask for forgiveness for these sins but by no means believe a loving God will fry me in hell for these.The new, hateful, judgmental political stuff seemed to show up about the time of Ronald Reagan and has gotten worse with the cancer of Dobson and Limbaugh hate radio, RNC Fox News and the likes of the Hukabees MacArthur and COUNTERWW who love to point their twisted judgmental fingers at others in the name of poor old Jesus.

  • KingDavidRetired

    It is now, as it was then, the narrow road that leads to Heaven is traveled by the few and the broad road that leads to destruction is traveled by the many. It has always been like this, and at least until Jesus returns, will always be like this. Jesus knew that most would reject Him and most have. I must stop because I was just kicked in the back of the head by someone somewhere and cannot write any more right now. There is sure a lot of hate in this world and it is the rejection of Christ that is, I would obviously know, at the very core of all the hate in the world. Who ever has done this to me again is plain and simply doing their masters bidding. Satan is there master. I sincerely hope all the haters would consider the truth that they are rejecting and the lies they are accepting. Not preaching, but accepting in themselves.

  • rohitcuny

    There is sure a lot of hate in this world and it is the rejection of Christ that is, I would obviously know, at the very core of all the hate in the world. Who ever has done this to me again is plain and simply doing their masters bidding. Satan is there master. I sincerely hope all the haters would consider the truth that they are rejecting and the lies they are accepting. Not preaching, but accepting in themselves. Posted by: KingDavidRetired Christians make a big mistake when they think that they alone know about love and about not hating. That love is more powerful than hate is a truth discovered by many many human beings, many of whom had never heard of Jesus/

  • 4thwatch

    Hello PastorJesus in His day was rejected just as He is at this very moment. For the son of a carpenter whose mother was the common woman called Mary to declare Himself to be the fulfillment of scripture was/is offensive to so many. When we regard Jesus as a reject, in truth we reject God.So if Jesus takes you out of your comfort zone don’t blame Him, the truth is you are uncomfortable with God. You know Pastor when God moves in ways that are strange to Christianity, ways that go against what Christians hold to as traditional God behavior and we refuse to accept such affairs to be of the Father. Even when such occurrences are in harmony with His word we still deny it, then a Christian becomes the lost one.

  • ashleybone

    After reading passages such as “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.”, I’m not sure how I failed to notice until now what a giant narcissist Jesus was. With such a critical example, it’s no wonder our culture is obsessed with self-love (at least if you believe MacArthur’s take on things).

  • coloradodog

    Ever notice how Huckabee “Christians” must always make themselves and others uncomfortable, guilty and grouchy. They take glee in the fact that someone is “out of their comfort zone” as if this is a natural state of humans instead of the opposite. It’s part of a control freak thing that helps them manipulate. The only comfort they seem to be able to find is a smug one that they alone are “saved” and the rest of us will go to hell.Do you think Jesus or a loving God intended to torture us by constantly lowering our self-esteem by making us feel unworthy? It’s not bad enough these Huckabees inflict their self-righteousness on others but even on their own like the Lutheran “church ladies” that told my mom her one day old baby went to hell because it wasn’t baptized. To this day this haunts my mother with perpetual guilt. Our natural state is not guilt, low self-esteem and discomfort. There is no love of Jesus here.

  • paul211

    “Let’s be brutally honest: most of Jesus’ teaching is completely out of sync with the mores that dominate our culture.”And completely out of sync with most of those who are commenting here! Which only serves to prove Dr. MacArthur’s point.

  • iamweaver

    ashleybone writes:Correct, in a way. Anyone who claims that Jesus is just “a good guy” hasn’t really read the Gospels. If Jesus isn’t an integral part of God, then he is a megalomaniac. Either that, the Bible is a sham and a hoax, as CCNL thinks. I’m not big on the scam/hoax side, mostly because I have felt the hand of God in my life and in my heart. After decades of living differently I was changed in an instant, through no real work on my part, other than the trite-but-true acceptance of the message of the Gospel. Repentance was the first step – but only the first step. Pastor MacArthur’s message emphasizes the beginning of one’s faith journey. It’s an important fragment of Jesus’ message, but still, only a fragment.

  • garoth

    Well, he’s got it half right. Jesus was certainly not PC. On the other hand, he certainly wouldn’t have had kind words for most of the garbage that passes for religion in this country, particularly that of the “Christian right.” Jesus was not about moral righteousness – the word, “righteousness,” refers to “right relationships.” Along side of his rants, he also pointed to a God of grace – one who tended to top political orders, who was on the side of the weak and powerless – something that most of contemporary Christianity has forgotten. In Luke’s Gospel, Mary’s song rather sets the tone for the rest of the story. In Matthew, the story begins with some astrologers from another country noticing what the religious of his own do not, and throughout the Gospel, it is the outsiders, the least and the lost who know his compassion. In Mark’s Gospel, not even his own disciples “get it.”For Paul, the chief evidence of the resurrection is that barriers have been torn down (beyond tolerance!) between sexes, between races, between classes – in a society that believed that these divisions were foundational to society. How often do you hear that preached in church?Jesus was also proclaimed as an alternative to the Ceasar-worship of the time. The titles used of him and his message were the same ones people were supposed to reserve for nation-worship. How often do you hear of Jesus’ message proposed as the alternative to our nation-worship?Like I said – we hear only half the message here. Unfortunately, that’s what we usually hear in church – half the Gospel. The “good news” for the oppressed is always bad news for the rich and powerful – and for those who want to turn the Gospel into more “rules to live by.”

  • practica1

    Paul edited and managed the Jesus franchise for a long time. He turned “whatsoever you do to the least of your brethren you do unto me” into ‘if they do not work, let them not eat”.Protestantism was as much an economic response to the same state religion systems as had been practiced by the Greeks and Romans and everyone before them, as it was to theology and biblical authority.The books have been blemished by human hands. Let’s admit it and worry more about being good than about the True Religion of Free Enterprise and Heterosexual Romance that we’ve been sold in America. At least Mormonism was something new that acknowledged contemporary ‘authority’ for its source.

  • amatthew

    John MacArthur is spot on. Going through some comments here only endorses that Christ will be rejected today as he was back then… and by our own ‘pharisaical’ christians. How society demands for a watered-down, compromised Christianity. The Bible is crystal clear that no one will enter heaven if not through Jesus Christ/God the Son/The Annointed/whatever.

  • outragex

    As a Christian, I think Rev. McArthur is right, but only hafl right in this column. Jesus was a rabble rouser in the best sense of the word, but McArthur only summarized half the story in this short column. Like most of us Christiansk, the reverend has, for this article at least, cherry picked parts of the Bible to support one facet of a multi-faceted God and Savior. Christian conservatives over-emphasize law and judgement, while liberals over-emphasize forgiveness, relationship, and overwhelming love. Likewise, the main focus for many conservatives is personal salvation, while the main focus for many liberals is bringing a small taste of God’s eternal kingdom to earth now.It is all a matter of balance, and from my understanding Rev. McArthur is leaning right in his attempt to balance out the left leaners. Perhaps a follow up article from McArthur would be welcome cherrypicking the pacifist, socialist, and feminist side of Jesus too? It’s all there when you read the Bible.

  • peterhuff

    Hi Coloradodog,I’m shortening your name to avoid the extra typing to “Colodog”. COLODOG: “Ever notice how Huckabee “Christians” must always make themselves and others uncomfortable, guilty and grouchy. They take glee in the fact that someone is “out of their comfort zone” as if this is a natural state of humans instead of the opposite. It’s part of a control freak thing that helps them manipulate. The only comfort they seem to be able to find is a smug one that they alone are “saved” and the rest of us will go to hell.”No, you are wrong. Christians are called to present the whole gospel, not just the sugar coated version. Since you operate on your own authority as a natural man, a man not spiritually alive to God, not supernaturally regenerated by His grace and Spirit, the tough love of the gospel is there to shake you out of your slumber, to make you realize your need for a Savior, that in your own merits you cannot save yourself from all the sin and injustice you have done in this world. So the gospels present this side to you and then it shows and points to the only One who can save you from the perfect justice of God for breaking So when the Christian presents the need for the Savior by showing the deprived condition you are in, he does it in love and in concern for your eternal well-being.And as Christians, we are called to judge what is good and hate what is evil, for the light of God is to shine through us. We are the salt of the earth, here to preserve what is good and to shine God’s light on what is evil. But when we judge we are first to remove the plank from our own eye before taking the spec from someone else’s, and only by the grace of God do we. In other words, do not be a hypocrite and tell someone not to do something that is wrong all the while practicing the exact same thing in greater detail. The question for you is where does your idea of “good” come from? Is there a fixed reference that you can point to, an objective standard and measure that you can make sense of “good” from? No. So we point you to the only One who can make sense of all of this.

  • peterhuff

    COLODOG: “Do you think Jesus or a loving God intended to torture us by constantly lowering our self-esteem by making us feel unworthy?”How would you know of your condition and your need unless God had revealed it? But He has and your conscience tries to suppress this truth so that you can be the one in control, master of your own destiny. It is not the arrogant and proud of heart who do everything their own way that hear the message, the Good News, but those who humbly submit to God, who seek after, who realize the state of depravity they are in, who recognize the truth of His word by His grace in His Son.COLODOG: “Our natural state is not guilt, low self-esteem and discomfort. There is no love of Jesus here.”How do you explain all the evil in this world, all those ruthless dictators such as Mao, Stalin, Poi Pot, Castro, Hitler, and the likes throughout history who have done according to their own standard of “good?” What makes them the subjective arbitrator of what good is? What makes you?There again, what is the basis for this statement of yours – your own authority? Can you point to anything higher than yourself and your own subjective opinion, in other words a fixed reference that you can know with 100% certainty is true? If not then there is no point in pursuing the matter further for you are your own final authority, subjective as it may be, and you make the rules until someone bigger and stronger comes along and decides that he makes the rules and that your rules are too puny to be “good.”. If this be the case, the only thing to be pointed out about your world view is you can’t make sense of anything without God. That is the point I am driving home.

  • rohitcuny

    Yesterday, I was watching the movie Eyes Wide Shut starring Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman. Cruise plays a doctor, Bill Harford, who is no doubt a good doctor but a rather foolish person who gets two people killed out of sheer clumsiness and excessive curiosity. Their marriage verges on infidelity even during the one or two days over which the movie takes place. The movie ends with Kidman saying, “At least we survived.” Now given that they are an attractive affluent couple living in a large apartment in Manhattan (?) and have a very nice daughter, one would expect a bit more thanAnd the problem of course is the utter lack of values from which this “secular” family suffers. So I do agree with those people like Mr. MacArthur that a lack of values coming from the demise of religion is a terrible thing.The problem is that if I look at my relatives back in Mumbai, there is no hanky panky, people generally get on with each other and everyone who was married in the mid fifties, is, fifty years later, still married. And not ONE of them is Christian.And this is the problem for me. I think that Chiristians do often suggest good values to us, but they do so in the name of a chauvinism, and a harsh view of sinners which makes it impossible to create a genuine force for the return of morality and decency.I would say to the good pastor, Please do not be chauvinistic. Morality is important, but it has not been copyrighted by your kind of Christians. Others practice it too, and ahem, quite often better. And God lives in many a heart which is not Christian. I very much doubt that the rate of divorce or infidelity among Christians in Mr. MacArthur’s church is anywhere as low as it is among my relatives. So be a bit humble.

  • ThomasBaum

    Counterww You wrote, “Jesus the son existed before he became a man. If you don’t know that, you need to re-read the NT”Jesus is the Second Person of the Trinity and always was and always will be, Jesus the Son of Man came into being at His Conception and at His Conception, He became the “Son of God” before that He was the “Second Person of the Trinity”, think about it.Did not Jesus say, “I and the Father are One”?”In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God”, As I have said, The Second Person of the Trinity became the Son of God and the Son of Man when Mary said YES, before that He was the Second Person of the Trinity and He was not a He either but a Being of Pure Love.You also wrote, “When i said God in my previous post, it was omitting God the Father.”I don’t know what you mean by this, could you explain?Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • coloradodog

    To PeterHuff,Congratulations on finding your God and the peace you claim that comes with Him in your own way. Too bad you’re not willing to allow others to do the same. I’m not saying you are wrong. I’m saying many of you spend more time judging and condemning than spreading the Gospel.How do you know for sure I’m wrong – because you cherry-pick Bible verses? You guys are quick to judge my godlessness, arrogance, rebelliousness, unrepentance and only God and you only know what more. I’m not saying you’re wrong, but the paradox of a loving God and equally loving Jesus holding their babies over the fiery pit of eternal damnation is for me cognitive dissonance.You’re too quick to try to jam your fundamentalist beliefs down the rest of our throats ASSuming we couldn’t believe in a Higher Power ourselves. Back off! This is still America where the First Amendment trumps your Bible as the law of the land.

  • coloradodog

    As someone you Huckabees have closed you minds to define as “..a man not spiritually alive to God, not supernaturally regenerated by His grace and Spirit..”, I bid you farewell to wallow in your own judgmental ignorance. May the Spirit who is one with us all forgive you.

  • ThomasBaum

    mbeck1 You wrote, “”If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple” (Luke 14:26).I guess Jesus wasn’t a big family man.”For your information, “hate” here means to love less and it means that God should come first above all including biological family, it does not mean the “hate” that you seem to think.As a matter of fact, if one does put God first then one is “commanded” to “love all”, of course from some of what is written, I can see why some would have a hard time believing that that is just what Jesus said, “I give you a new command, “Love one another as I have loved you”.So our family should actually extend beyond our “biological” family to include the entire “human” family, since God created every human being that has been , is or will be.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • Dermitt

    Too much plastic Jesus and not enough Diamond Jesus. That’s a good band name. We need a new band sisters. I’m just saying.

  • peterhuff

    Hi Rohitcuny,ROHITCUNY: “Hate is not overcome by hate; by Love alone is hate appeased. This is an eternal law.” This message of love came from the Buddha, five hundred years before Jesus was born.”What are the earliest preserved copies of the Buddha’s message? How many copies do you have in which to make sense of what the original said? How reliable have they been transcribed? Are your earliest copies dating back to before or after the time of Christ? Was Buddha more than a man when he walked this earth. Did he claim to be divine? Did he die and rise again? Is the unity of his message like that of the Christian and Hebrew Scriptures?ROHITCUNY: “Christians make a big mistake when they think that they alone know about love and about not hating. That love is more powerful than hate is a truth discovered by many many human beings, many of whom had never heard of Jesus/”Christians speak the truth in Jesus, not in and of themselves unless they think God’s thoughts after Him. Buddhism and Christianity make a lot of conflicting claims. Both cannot be a revelation from God since and all-knowing Being would not speak in contradictions. How could He make Himself understood by doing so? He wouldn’t say that there is only one means, one Name, one way under heaven by which men must be saved and then contradict Himself by presenting another. It is all works righteousness outside of Jesus Christ, what the person does to appease their imaginary god and how they earn merit points before their god by what they do and how they live. The Christian points to what Christ has done on behalf of those who believe. There is no bragging or merit on their own part. It is Christ IN us, the hope of glory! The eternal life of Jesus Christ living in us and through us and us counted dead by God to our old nature (for Christ died in our place to reconcile us to God); made new creations in Christ Jesus, rescued by God!Only He, not Buddha, lived a life of perfect obedience, as a man, before God, to fulfill the law of God that God set for man and then took our punishment upon Himself for our wrongful acts, in our place, to present us as clean before God, in right standing and having met God’s righteous requirements through Christ, the One we have been united to in faith. God made Him, who had no sin, to be sin for us! He came to save those who would believe on Him and on His merit alone.

  • peterhuff

    Hi Coloradodog,COLODOG: “Congratulations on finding your God and the peace you claim that comes with Him in your own way. Too bad you’re not willing to allow others to do the same.” First of all, He found me and rescued me. Second, I’m pointing you to the Way, the Lord Jesus Christ, as revealed in the Bible. You won’t find God apart from Him. I’m telling you the “Good News”, that eternal life is found in Him alone and I’m pointing to your predicament. COLODOG: “I’m not saying you are wrong. I’m saying many of you spend more time judging and condemning than spreading the Gospel.”That is right, for you can’t say I’m wrong unless you have and objective standard, that is God, to measure wrong by. And as an unbeliever I’m hoping and praying that you come to Christ, who is the truth, who can set you free from error and the ways that lead to death.You want to come to Him by your own rules, by your standard, in your own merit. First make sense of your standard to see if it is capable of making sense of anything. That is what I am pressing you to do before you condemn what I am saying as judgmental.COLODOG: “How do you know for sure I’m wrong – because you cherry-pick Bible verses? You guys are quick to judge my godlessness, arrogance, rebelliousness, unrepentance and only God and you only know what more.”Because I’m looking through the light of God’s word, His timeless, eternal, righteous word that tells me you are wrong. I appeal to the highest authority there is. What authority do you appeal to?I take as my starting point that His word is truth and from it I can make sense of all things when I rightly discern it. I have this external standard, an outside myself fixed and unchanging reference point that is necessary to make sense of anything by. He answers the most important and fundamental questions of life, such as why and I here, how do I know, what difference does it make and what is my destination and hope for the future.What does your world view, the way you look at life tell you is certain? Why are you here? Who determines what good is? Is there meaning and purpose in life other than what you make it to be?Try answering these questions and making sense of them. When you can’t, look to the God of the Bible and to His Son. There you will find the meaning of life and the love that is so desperately sought in a world of conflicting truth claims.

  • peterhuff

    COLODOG: “I’m not saying you’re wrong, but the paradox of a loving God and equally loving Jesus holding their babies over the fiery pit of eternal damnation is for me cognitive dissonance.”There again, you are looking at life through your own tinted glasses. Take them off and ask Him to see it though His eyes if you want to make sense of anything (1 Corinthians 1:18-25). Ask Him to give you an understanding of His word, that you would have ears to hear the message.You do not see the whole picture, neither do I. When you talk about a loving God holding babies over the fiery pit you are not trusting that God is good, a righteous and just Judge. He will judge all fairly and according to their merit; that merit either being by faith in Christ’s merit or separate from Christ merit, on their own stead.What you are doing is judging God by your limited faulty reasoning and understanding and not allowing His word to judge you and point you to His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. You want to be the final say in what will be and what is good; you, who like me, do not see the whole picture.COLODOG: “You’re too quick to try to jam your fundamentalist beliefs down the rest of our throats ASSuming we couldn’t believe in a Higher Power ourselves. Back off! This is still America where the First Amendment trumps your Bible as the law of the land.”Sorry, actually I’m Canadian. But seriously, are you not the one ASSuming that you can make sense of anything outside of the Judeao-Christian God? What revelation do you point to as your higher power? Is it written down and preserved that man may have a fixed standard? Let’s check it out.

  • libertyordeath2000

    Thank you Washington Post for being brave and going out of your norm and lending today’s column to a “man of truth” The Word today has went out today and it will not come back void!!For all that hear it should look at the attributes of our Holy God and why He sent his precious son!!! Many of the posts today sound much like the pluralistic minds of soddom,gommorah,and ninevah!!Make no mistake how loving it it for a Holy God to send his only begotten son to live a perfect life and give himself as the unblemish sacrifice for us-satisfying the wrath that we deserve!!Your self righteousness and plurality thinking will not serve you well on judgement day!!You believe that there is one God; you do well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

  • peterhuff

    Hi Rohitcuny,ROHITCUNY: “And the problem of course is the utter lack of values from which this “secular” family suffers. So I do agree with those people like Mr. MacArthur that a lack of values coming from the demise of religion is a terrible thing.”You are speaking of values. Where do they come from? If each person, or each culture makes up the values they live by, there is no ultimate measure, standard, fixed reference point, source, etc., so all you have is personal or group preference, mere opinion. That is the problem with the world. What makes one opinion right over another? Let me answer that; only an objective, absolute, omniscient Being. Without Him nothing has meaning, but you live as though things do have meaning, so you borrow from the Christian world view.ROHITCUNY: “The problem is that if I look at my relatives back in Mumbai, there is no hanky panky, people generally get on with each other and everyone who was married in the mid fifties, is, fifty years later, still married. And not ONE of them is Christian.”That is because we are living in an age of relativism where almost everybody makes up their own truths that runs counter to God’s standard, much to the shame of many who profess the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. They ignore His Lordship and what the word of Scripture says.

  • inTXjoe

    Amazing! So many of these comments hold up truth as something that cannot be known and should not be strived after. Most religions claim exclusivity, so they cannot all be right. If one is right, is it not of the utmost importance to seek after that truth? And since when did tolerance come to mean keeping our mouths shut and never voicing our opinion… and on that note, when did disagreement automatically mean someone is full of hate or condemnation? Tolerance is respecting someone else’s right to an opinion, not automatically giving up your own. And disagreement is just that, disagreement. It does not imply hate or malice.MacArthur is Biblically right-on in this article. He does not go on to explain the good news of Jesus dying for our sins, but what he does voice is accurate. I find it sad and astounding that so many people who hear the news that there is freedom from the consequence and slavery of sin, and instead of taking hope, respond with venom and malice to the same person who cared enough to tell them the uncomfortable truth. I also find it amazing that many who claim the name “Christian” are angered by the mere mention of the word “Repent” and flat out fume at any mention of the Lordship of Jesus Christ.Find a good modern day translation of the Bible such as the NLT or ESV and read Romans, thoughtfully and prayerfully. Check out a few websites you normally wouldn’t such as Churchsalt.com or Thebareessentials.org and see what God might work in your heart. If you do claim the name “Christian”, take 15 minutes to read 1st John to see if it is a name you can claim with Biblical blessing.

  • warrenoff

    i thank the post for putting up the article and thank pastor john for hos clear understanding of interperting Gods word.pastor john style of expository teaching ,some one ask him why he teaches like that ,and his comments were that teaching been around for centuries ,it just other pastors have are not teaching like that cause they just are lazy and dont want to do the work,you cant skim coat the teachings of Jesus ,Jesus never taugh like that.Pastor john is taking out of scripture that is called (exegetical),where most psters put there owen twisted ideas in ,i can say that cause i have had first hand experience from liberial church teaching to conservative teaching ,were it amazing what jesus was doing warning loving us dfoes not want any one to spend eternity in hell,Jesus was the only in history who taught more abut hell. here a great web for all christains and non,great biblebulletin.com resource page.

  • warrenoff

    Heres some thing to think about we all live in a day and age where we have grown used to having a choice .when we go shopping we choose several different varities fo apples,when we travel some wherewe have the choice or bus,train,plane,boat,.Choice abounds. Despite all our choices-in life there are just some things we don’t get a choicewhatsoever.We don’t get to choose are parents,we don’t get to choose the day we are bornon,and we don’t get to choose the day we will die.We couldsaythat life’s most important decision are made for us.Do you have Eternal Life? Well the answer is God makes that decision and we need to respond to it by understanding 5 non- negttiable realities about eternal life.

  • warrenoff

    5 non-negotiable realities about eternal life. 1)GODEXISTS AND REVEALS HIMSELF IN THE BIBLE. 2)MAN IS MADE IN GOD’S IMAGE AND WE NEED TO SUBJECT TO HIM. 3)SIN HAS BROKEN OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD AND NOW THEREARE CONSEQUENCES 4)JESUS CHRIST IS GOD VEILED IN HUMAN FLESH COMING TO SAVE US FROM OUR SINS 5)(DISCIPLESHIP)FOLLOWING JESUS IS A HARD AND NARROW ROAD 6)(KNOWING GOD) HOW CAN I RESPOND TO GOD’S TO GODS OFFER OF SALVATION

  • warrenoff

    i encourage all if you hav not to read thru the in one year. go on the web and type in formats on reading God word 1 or 2 chaters every day in your spare time ,and we all have spare time plus the book of john i found a good format to read. there are 21 chapters read the first7 for a month ,then the next for a month then the last 7 fora month . and while you are reading in your thoughts and spirit ask him God if you are real show me and He will ,but it are will that needs to open up are self righteosness and pride and ignorrance,need to humble are selfs .my prayer to all let the Lord jesus in satan and hell are real ,if you have no desire to read thru the bible or thru john , maybe you should start at the book of Revelation what happen to all that reject God ,his Son and the guidance and helper the Holy Spirit. ( If you living like there is no God ,you better be right)

  • warrenoff

    in my comments i did not put and scriptures as many comments that i have veiwed on here are there, and shows the warning and message Jesus came to teach us and warn us about our spiritual suicide condition,if you want scrioture will give you lots but encourage just read,that the problem people wont read the bible ,but one thing is you wont understand most of it cause unless you are lead by the spirit(1 Corinthian 2:6-16) it will just be a good history book,but it more than that its Gods revaling Hims self thru His Son Jesus. here are some John 17:17, 2 Timothy 3:16, Genesis1:1, 17:1, 1:26-27 Eodus 3:14,Isaiah 44:6b-7a,. and more.just start starting (read)

  • mikebike473

    To those who say the God in the OT is a wrathful God and the one in the NT is not, where in the world did you get that?! The God of the OT is the same God as in the NT. There is a plethora of OT verses that say God is gracious, compassionate, long- suffering, & merciful – even in the prophets, who routinely prophesied God’s judgment on wayward Israel. Look how he was patient with Israel as they continued to be filled with unbelief and disobedience. His wrath was on reserve for Christ! You want to see God displaying the cup of His wrath to the full? Then read the NT where He exhausted His wrath toward our sin by killing His only Son, Jesus Christ on the cross in our stead.

  • mikebike473

    MacArthur is narrow because the Bible is narrow. If you are going to fault him for this, at least acknowledge that he is being faithful to the Bible. Christianity is all about what God has done to make things right between Himself as our Creator and us who have sinned against Him. It is about how God reconciled us to Himself in the person and work of Christ, which culminated in the cross. The cross is how God brings us to Himself. It is how a holy, good, loving, merciful, and just God becomes our Father. By the cross God maintained His goodness and justice by Christ’s sin- and wrath-bearing death. If a judge lets someone off who commits a crime without punishment, would that judge be good and just? No! You see, Jesus lived the life you and I could not live. He perfectly obeyed His own law as God in our stead. This perfect life of obedience- God’s righteousness- is given to us when we believe. We are covered with it. It is what God sees when He looks at a believer, and it is how we are justified in God’s sight. God sees Christ when He looks at the believer because He has graciously covered us with His life which alone is acceptable to Him. Then, the death and judgment we deserve, Christ took in our place as our substitute on the cross. You see, it was by the cross that the God of the universe chose to reconcile us to Himself. What could be more amazing, gracious, and loving for human beings than what God has done for us in His Son? This is a message of grace, mercy, and compassion. So, as you see, we Christians have to be “narrow-minded” and intolerant of other religions. We cannot be pluralists, thinking there are multiple ways to God, because we believe the Bible, and the Bible says our biggest problem is that we are sinners and are at enmity with the holy and just Creator of the universe. God, to be consistent with His character must punish sin (see above for example of a judge), and He did this in His Son so we can be reconciled to Him. Only Christ can reconcile us! Now if we think this is true and that you’re in danger of facing God’s wrath for your sins for all eternity, don’t you think the loving thing to do is to tell you about this? So, if you cannot bear with this, that puts you in a place of intolerance, and if you cannot tolerate us then you will have to do what is done in many parts of the world and just kill us off. We cannot compromise and be true to the Bible at the same time, & those who DO compromise aren’t truly Christians. Please, if you really want to evaluate Christianity fairly, read Tim Keller’s book, “The Reason for God”. This is the only way many of you who do not believe are going to be able to make a fair assessment of Christianity. You owe it to yourself and you owe it to being honest with the claims of Christianity. And may I also add, read the Bible for yourself instead of making assumptions on what you’ve heard.

  • mikebike473

    To those who say MacArthur is yanking verses here and there out of context as he sees fit, you need to know that the way MacArthur preaches is mostly by preaching through books of the Bible. He uses a historical-grammatical way of interpreting Scripture, which means that he pays close attention to context. Context applies to both the immediate text he is dealing with, the context of whatever book of the Bible he is preaching through, and what the author was saying to a group of believers at that time in history. This means he also looks at the history, geography, manners, customs, etc of the setting in which the Bible is written. He does not start with an English text as you and I would, but from Greek for a NT passage and Hebrew for an OT passage. He and his assistants undergo painstaking research to achieve this accurately. Further, he makes large use of the writings of other biblical scholars. He is not going to pull fanciful, novel, new interpretations from the Bible, nor is he going to fill in with cutesy stories to elicit laughs & emotional responses. He is consistent with the way the Bible has been understood throughout the centuries. In large part, he mostly agrees with the majority of historical Protestants in their view of the Bible. It is a shame that this is not true today, but as time goes on people who call themselves Christians continue to invent new interpretations that are not derived from careful scholarship, but are usually more in line with some kind of mystical form of religion. This degrades Christianity in many people’s sight because there is so much disunity among people who call themselves believers on what the Bible means. The key is to go back before the 1800s (when so many different versions of Christianity began) and see who lines up today with believers from the 1700s and before. Much of what calls itself Christianity today would not even be recognized by believers of the past.

  • mikebike473

    Many of the comments I have read are made out of ignorance. Many of the things you fault MacArthur for are simply not true. Take it from one who has been listening to his sermons since 1990 and who owns and has read most of his books. Those of you who are basing your erroneous assumptions about MacArthur on what you have picked up from mainstream TV preachers, the media, & elsewhere are being intellectually dishonest. It pains me to read how many of you have totally misrepresented MacArthur in your comments. First, MacArthur is highly critical of the religious right and how they emphasize politics instead of the gospel. He has written a book on this and also has addressed it in quite a few sermons. Knowing his preaching & writings, it is plain ridiculous to equate him with Huckabee, Falwell, Dobson, Palin, etc. Many of the “conservatives” and “religious right” people you associate him with have criticized him! Next, MacArthur does not preach a God who is wrathful toward babies who die, but the opposite, as seen in his book “Safe in the Arms of God.” This is a very comforting book and I would recommend the lady whose mom was terrorized by the “Lutheran Women” to buy this book for your mom. It will help her if she is a believer. Read the Amazon reviews on the book; many of them are really touching. Thirdly, MacArthur has very little in common with most of evangelical Christianity. Most Southern Baptists would be at odds with him and vice versa, although many of them do not realize this. He is a modern-day reformer. He is very well connected theologically with historical protestant reformed baptistic Christianity. He would not have many differences with non- liberal (and therefore more true to their heritage) Presbyterian, Congregationalist, some Methodist, and others. There is a consistency between him and many historical leaders. Many of his books are polemical, in which he is dealing with the rampant errors that have crept in among the modern-day church. In this way, he is working to bring the church more in line with historical Christianity in regard to various theology as well as Christian practice.

  • peterhuff

    Well said InTXjoe and Mikebike473!

  • warrenoff

    well said mikebike 473,i myself am a listener , of pastor john.yes heaven is very narrow and very few are going thru.thank- you for you like minded ness.And to all of who don’t believe if you are still breathing and ticking it is by the Grace ,love compassionate of God He is keep you here to respond to Him(God)thru His son Jesus our Savior who took the worlds sins on our behalf.for salvation the work was finished on the cross( Ephesian 2:8-9).Keep this in your thoughts, we all should be hanging on that cross ,not our perfect Lord and Saviour. again some of us here have said start reading,if you dont like to read lots of good OT-NT bible on CD.If some of you that are not beleivers if a stranger ,or friend has shared the Gospel to you and you said like most people no thanks rather be going to Hell, i said that cause you saying to God not intrested send me there, remember there are only two places we all go pick the right one.,maybe go back and pick there brain at the same time .Read the Bible it not about perfect people it lost people and showing the great news on how you can get thru this life and spend eternity with Jesus as our teacher and guidance and hope and not in our selfrightousness where there is quick gratifaction,not saying we christains have it all together,it we have the best instruction ,compass book the world will ever know , and it availble to all.

  • ThomasBaum

    mikebike473 You wrote, “Then read the NT where He exhausted His wrath toward our sin by killing His only Son, Jesus Christ on the cross in our stead.”Actually, we killed Jesus on the cross, God didn’t.You then wrote, “Keep this in your thoughts, we all should be hanging on that cross ,not our perfect Lord and Saviour.”First off, according to God’s Plan, Jesus, took our (humanity’s) place so Jesus, God-Incarnate, is not only exactly where He chose to be, He chose to be there even before creation itself. God’s Plan, Jesus becoming One of us and doing what He did being part of God’s Plan, is still unfolding before our very eyes and will come to Fruition.Second, Jesus extended His invitation to “Come follow Me” and even tho some thinks that means only to be “Easter people”, Jesus is also calling us to be “Good Friday people”, as Jesus said, “There is work to be done”.Considering that Jesus said, “Father forgive them”, have you ever thought that after one is forgiven that one should be an imitator of Jesus by asking for forgiveness of ALL? Jesus did NOT say ‘Father forgive them except for’, did He?Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • mikebike473

    Thomas Paul Moses Baum,

  • mikebike473

    You then wrote, “Keep this in your thoughts, we all should be hanging on that cross ,not our perfect Lord and Saviour.”Thomas Paul Moses Baum,

  • ThomasBaum

    mikebike473 First off, I want to apologize, it was my mistake, that second quote was from Warrenhoff not you.You wrote, ” I think it is so easy to get caught up in thinking about his physical sufferings (which was bad of course and grieves me), and forget about Him enduring our deserved eternity in Hell on the cross.”I have said many times in my postings that Jesus took ALL of the sins of humanity upon Himself not just the sins of those that repent.I have also said that Jesus went to Hell, as in He suffered in ways that are beyond human comprehension and many, many get so caught up in the phsicality of His death they lose sight of or don’t even think that there was much more going on.This is why I have said that Jesus is the Saviour of All of humanity. In doing what He did Jesus won the “keys” of hell and spiritual death and will use them in due time, God’s Time.I have also said that hell is not the monolithic place that some seem to think it to be but is actually going to God and seeing oneself and all of one’s crud, (wrongdoing, sin whatever one wishes to call it), in the Light of Pure Love.If one were to die and wake up in hell, so to speak, one would come to the realization that one has no one but oneself to blame.Spiritual death is seperation from God. Hell and spiritual death are two different things and God won the keys to both.God knew that not all would repent, that is why God has His Plan which He has had since before creation and His Plan will come to Fruition.If it was ultimately only for those that repent then God could have stuck His Head, so to speak, out of heaven and yell words to that effect but God came up with a Plan where we are invited to be “active participants” in God’s Saving Plan for humanity.Jesus called us to be “Good Friday” people for others, He did say that there was work to be done, didn’t He?One way to look at it is, we can be asked to be cleaned up, so to speak, or God will clean us up. God is not the loser that so many think that He is.So many people speak of God’s Justice and omit God’s Mercy when God’s Justice and Mercy are two sides of the same coin, so to speak.I use the masuline pronoun because it is handy but God is not a He, a She or an It, even tho God-Incarnate was a Male, but God is a Being of Pure Love and all else flows from this Fact. You also wrote, ” What “cup” was it that Christ was asking the Father if there was any way to take it away from Him. It was the cup of God’s wrath.”I have addressed this and Jesus asks us to drink of that “cup” also, doesn’t He?Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    mikebike473You wrote, “Jesus, as God incarnate, did come on a divine rescue mission planned before the foundation of the world to rescue sinners and bring them into His kingdom and is still doing so today.”Didn’t Jesus say, “Take my yoke upon you…”, in this way Jesus walks with us and He also said, “I will send the Holy Spirit to guide you…”, in this way God is working thru us even today, as I have said, Jesus invited us to be “active participants” rather than just “passive observers” in God’s Plan for the Salvation of All Humanity, it is up to us to accept the invitation.As I have said before and I say again, Christianity is just part of God’s Plan and it is not about getting a “get out of hell” card but to be “active participants.Gospel means Good News and if the Good News is not for All then it is not good news at all!You also wrote, “I do not know if you’ve read much John MacArthur”As far as I know, I have never read anything from John MacArthur.You then wrote, “As for your 3rd paragraph, I’m not sure I follow you well but if I am I would say, yes, we as believers should be out in the “field” of the world preaching the gospel to mankind telling them there is a Creator who is holy and who they are accountable to as sinners. We should tell them what it means for them to be a sinner, and then tell them the “good news” of what God has done in Christ on the cross, thus telling them about God’s forgiveness.”God chose me to speak, so I speak. I have no idea what anyone else should do, if you feel led by God to do something, then do it.There are some that know God’s Name but that seems to be the extent of what they know about God. Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • warrenoff

    hello mike and thomas paul moses yes that is a very beautiful name . my apoligizes for not elaborating on my question about we should be on the cross nor Jesus ,yes mike that was Gods plan in the beginning. It was a rechtorical i guess state ment,for some of the other comments for letting people really think of the seriousness of Gods warnings thru his Word.yes we are presdestine be fore time ,or we have been called not all are going to heaven,God does not want any to perish ,it breaks my heart to see people jokingly say well i guess i am going to helland not responding to the message ,i know not all will, it should be for us true believers to still feel for the lost knowing that we were living at once in disobedience pertaining to ( Ephesians 2:1-10) ,as true genuine believers yes i agree on your comments ,about we still need to be witnessing . i remember listening to pastor john macarthur on one of his messages .waiting patiently for the Lords return,watching how he coming and keep doing His work.pertaing to passages( Matthew 24: 25:1-13 ,MARK 13:24:27 ,LUKE 21:25-28. again sorry to all not explain that comment ,thanks mike for see that. Slave in Christ Warren Hewko

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoff You wrote, “yes we are presdestine be fore time”I would like to make two comments about this: First, “predestined” means that God knows, it does not mean that we do not have a choice; Second, since God knew that not all would “repent” and God knows who “repents” because God is the One Who is the searcher of hearts and minds, we aren’t, that is why God came up with His Plan even before Creation.God’s Plan is for ALL to be in the Kingdom, the new heavens and the new earth.I look past heaven to the Kingdom.Jesus went to hell, “My God, My God why have Thou forsaken Me?”, cavalry was much more than the physical act of crucifixion, since Jesus took upon Himself ALL of the sins of ALL of humanity for ALL time.Jesus won the keys and Jesus will use the keys in due time, God’s Time.As I have said, we are to be “Easter people” that are also called to be “Good Friday people”.God’s Plan is referred to as the “mysterious Plan of God” and God’s Plan will come to Fruition.As I have also said, God wins, satan loses, a tie is unacceptable.See you and the rest of humanity in the Kingdom.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • warrenoff

    hello thomas,are you saying that all humanity if everyone gets saved ,Christ died for the world, sinners then most people in the church ,all you have to do is tell sinners that He (Jesus) loves you so muchhe paid the price ,He wants them to be saved and all they have to do is respond? there are some people out there that if you just figure out a technique of getting some emotional point,you can win anyone on the planet to Christ.I read a aquote out from(purpose driven church) I can lead anyone to christ if i can find the key to that persons heart)The book misses alot of repentance and justifactions santifiaction alot very im[portant key point just threw that in there reguarding that book.those are popular ideas.Heres the fall out, lot of people in hell Christ died for or another way of putting , hell is full of people whos sins were paid on the cross in full. Lake of fire burns forever,right, with brimestone and it is filled with eternally damned people whos sins Christ paid for on the cross,atoned fully.Gods wrath satisfied by Christ atonement on behalf of those people who forever who will stay in hell. Goodnews to that heaven will also be populated by souls of those whom Christ died. Christ did the same for occupinates of hell as he did of the occupinates of heaven.makes the question a little disturbing . the difference is the people in heaven accept the gift, the people in hell rejected it. That is much the traditinal evangelicial view. plus the the bible covers the doctrines of election, we cant just pick and choose out of Gods word an easy believism message and take passages out of context scripture compliments scripture, that suite us or others there are alot of movements out there that are doing that in the churches and are not getting taught the full message of Gods warnings of true means of salvation , we need to apply and study and take out all the Overview of Theology.About God the Father,God the Son,Man,Salvation, Election,Regeneration, justification, Sanctifaction,Security,Seperation,the Chuch,Holy Angels,Fallen Angels, Last things(Eschatology) Death, The Rapture of the Church, The Tribulation period, The Second Coming and the Millennial Reign, The Judgement of the Lost,and Eterinty.it all there. Revelation22:18-19 fOR I TESTIFY TO EVERYONE WHO HEARS THE WORDS OF THIS PROPHECY OF THIS BOOK:IF ANYONE ADDS TO THESE THINGS,GOD WILL ADD TO HIM THE PLAGUES THAT ARE WRITTEN IN THIS BOOK :AND IF ANYONE TAKES AWAY FROM THE WORDS OF THIS BOOK OF THIS BOOK, GOD SHALL TAKE AWAY HIS PART FROM THIS BOOK OF LIFE, FROMTHE HOLY CITY, AND FROM THE THINGS WHICH ARE WRITEN IN THIS BOOK..SORRY ALL AGAIN FOR THE CAPS,PASTOR JOHN IS VERY CLEAR, THE OLD SAYING TRUTH HURTS ,BUT TRUTH DOES MATTER CHEERS WARRENOFF

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas i understand ressurection weekend in april,but what do you mean we All need to be Good friday People ?

  • warrenoff

    for got the most important on my first comment reguarding overview of theoloy and (God the Holy Spirit),wow lol cheers warrenoff

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas looking at passage of 1 peter 3:19-20.just want to comment on what you said of jesus going to hell and jesus calling out why have you for saken me. jesus was put to death physically ,but alive in the spirit, yes He went to Hell he was in the ground for three days and where he went to Hell to preach to the spirits in prision ,what happen is his body was dead those three days and He goes and preaches . It important to look at the word preached,is not the word “euaggelizo( to preach the gospel)its the word keruuso ( which means to announce proclamatiom ,proclaming victory)very important to note that difference.He is not preaching the gospel, He proclaiming a truimph ,he prclaimed a victory un to the spirits in prision.might say who are these spirits look at v20 of 1 peter3,who ever these spirits were they were diobedient in the days of Noah.these were angels that did what? who cohabitated with the sons of men. They were angels that sinned in Noahs time.copare the book of jude with this and you will see the same indication.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoff You wrote, “hey thomas i understand ressurection weekend in april,but what do you mean we All need to be Good friday People ?”First off, there would be no Resurrection on Easter Sunday without Jesus’s Death on Good Friday.Second, Jesus mentioned about the “cup” that He had to drink and He also mentioned to the Apostles that they had a share in the “cup” and so do we.Third, Jesus died for us so that with us taking Jesus’s yoke upon us, we can die for others.Jesus either took our sins upon Himself or He didn’t, if Jesus did, then Jesus also took upon Himself the consequences associated with those sins, so Jesus also experienced hell, Jesus did not just “visit” those in hell.In doing so, Jesus won the “keys” to both hell and death and will use them in due time.God has a Plan and God’s Plan flows from the fact that God is a Being of Pure Love.Bottom line: God wins, satan loses, a tie is unacceptable.See you and the rest of humanity in the Kingdom, the new heavens and the new earth.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoffYou wrote, “there are some people out there that if you just figure out a technique of getting some emotional point,you can win anyone on the planet to Christ.”We were asked to “Proclaim the Gospel” and the word “Gospel” means “Good News” so Gospel and Good News are one and the same.Since, “God is Love” is a literal statement, God and Love are One and the same.”Proclaiming the Gospel” can be with words but not all are called to proclaim with words but we are all called to proclaim the “Gospel” with our lives.Some people would rather look for “techniques” in spreading the “Gospel” rather than spreading the “Gospel” by their living the “Gospel”.We are to “Proclaim” by word and action, all of the rest is God’s Work. Even our “Proclaiming” could be called God’s Work considering that it is God working thru us.It is said that “Faith is a gift, that no man should boast”, how many times have people heard other people say, “Look how many I have led to Jesus”, whereas one should be thankful if they were of some use in God’s Work here on earth.God has “His Work” and we have “our work” and “our” work is just that, God and someone.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas,i agree God is Love,but God is just and has justice,scripture is saturated just read the OT ,God hates sin,and Jesus died on the cross for sins of the world,and unbelievers and some believers who call them selves christains they flaunt sin in all ares and think it ok.yes God is Love.bur God clearly explains to us why we are now all sinners,and constantly disobeying His Word. When we examine sin we must remember that God is soveregin and He is the one who rules all things including us. He is the one who establishes right and wrong and by virtue of who He he is- demands that we the creature submit to the Creator.definition of sin i think we all heard this one ,missing the mark picturing an archer firind an arrow at the bull’s eye yet missing everytime.In our Life sin is evidenced consistently by missing God’s standard of holiness through rebellion,transgression, perversion, impiety, unrighteousness,law lessness,depravity,and evil desire.Because of our sin we are not able to have a right relationship with God.So we reject His right to hold us accountable to Hos divine standards and his authority over us. Therefore God’s rightto be who He is as Lord is denied.Sin is an act of disobedience toGod’s revealed truth.It is the absence of righteousness in one’s life and the enmity towards our creator. Yet , we are all still held to account for our sin byGod.Everyone is born in a sinful state and condition.Sin permeates or innermost being and is at the coreopf the human heartsoul(Matthew 15:19-20).Root of sinn is man rebellion against God. Sin places man at allcenter of activity and remove God at His rightful place as Creator and Lord.

  • warrenoff

    yes thmas i agree with of the gospel (goodnews) and actions and words with the work of the Lords Spirit promting,there are people out there where the Lord has called(doctrine of election) awakend there souls and spirit to respond to add to His Kingdom.God,you know i have come across Roman Catholics which I was rasied in that false teachings of the RC and papacy and there total deceptive teachings and thank the Lord for getting me out there ,where i still have family and freinds ,that i do Love very much and praying for them to see , but again thats the Lord work to reveal,and for the RC to get ride of there pride and iggnorence ,like all of us to see the truth. (True Genuine Christainity is not a blind Faith,is is an Informative Faith).here is some scripture about Gods hating sin ,yes His Grace is amazing .as I ended in the my first comments ,i will pick up here It affect our intellect(2Corinthians4:4).conscience(1 Timothy 4:2), will(Romans1″28), and heart( Ephesians 4:18).Sin is not just failure and lack on our behalf ,or evendeficiencyofsome sort.but it is the lack and rejection or true knowledge. Sinwould alsc consist ot acts that we do and fail to do. The result of sinis that man is totally depraved(Ephesians 2:1-3).An out plsying of sin upon people is that they attemp to erase the memory of God or change the existance or nature of God into somethingelse. Gos clearly reveals what sin does upon knowledgeof Him in our world.you nedd to read (Roman 1:18-25)If christains are really saved and really Love God through His son Jesus our Lord and High Preist ,we need to be (Sanctified and Obedient to His Word and Jesus warng all of us, some people might call ma narrow minded ,yes i am because the Gospel IS narrow,right narrow is the gate to enternal Life , and Broad is the Gate to destuction(Matthew 7:13-23)Hebrews 11:6 cleary explains with out faithit is impossible to please Him,. Hell is real and being seperated from God is real (Matthew13:42), related scripture, (Mark9:43-43),(Revelation 14:11; 20:10,15,21:8).God is a Loving God,but we must remember that He is a Holy and just God who hates sin. Therefore God will deal with sin in your life, by virtue of His soverignty over us and of His character of justice. God will do this through Jesus Christ. All people will one day meet Jesus Christ face to face. God-has fixed a day in which He will judge the world in righteourness through a Man whom He has appointed,having furnished proof to all men by raising Him from the dead(17:31). If you choose to reject God in this life- God will reject you( reguarding humanity) in the life to come. Since you( reguarding humanity)choose to live an ungodly life in this temporal place- God will confirm your choice for ever. God’s judgementis just.right.perfect,and with out error, and we should notexpect anything less fron a holy God. cheers Warrenoff h.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoffYou wrote, “God is just and has justice,”What about MERCY?You also wrote, “God hates sin,”Do you know why?You also wrote, “He is the one who establishes right and wrong and by virtue of who He he is- demands that we the creature submit to the Creator.”Actually, God wants us to come to Him willingly, as in we make the choice since God gave us free will.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoff You wrote, “i have come across Roman Catholics which I was rasied in that false teachings of the RC and papacy and there total deceptive teachings and thank the Lord for getting me out there”Do you know that the “Roman Catholic” Eucharist is Jesus? The Holy Spirit revealed this to me on the 29th of January in the year 2000. Jesus left absolutely no doubt that this is what He meant when He instituted this Sacrament, on what is called Holy Thursday, at what is referred to as The Last Supper.You also wrote, “Hebrews 11:6 cleary explains with out faithit is impossible to please Him,.”It also says somewhere that “faith is a gift that no man should boast” so apparently, some do not have this gift or have not opened this gift so those “with faith” are not called to come and pick up their “get out of hell” card but to carry on the mission of Jesus with Jesus’s yoke upon them, don’t you think?You also wrote, “Hell is real and being seperated from God is real”I know that hell is real because I have experienced it and I know that spiritual death, which is what separation from God is, is real because I have also experienced that.You also wrote, “God’s judgementis just.right.perfect,and with out error, and we should notexpect anything less fron a holy God.”Have you ever heard of MERCY, I could be wrong but I do not think that you have ever mentioned MERCY, have you?As I have mentioned before, it is written: “My Ways are not your ways and My Thoughts are not your thoughts”.God has a Plan which God has had since before creation and God’s Plan will come to Fruition.It is written: “It is God’s Will that ALL be saved”, God’s Will, will come to Fruition.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • warrenoff

    so thomas im a summing you are Roman catholic,you know that the Eucharist,,and the wine ,or grape juice some people ,take atcommuinion or the Lord’s Supper., is a symbol of Christ death and shedding of blood.the mass is the same thing as when mosses when he came down from the mount sini,as they all convince aron to gather all the gold to make the golden calfto worship God,it idoltary worship,you need to read hebrews start at chapter 8 to the end of chapter 10,that about purgatory if you believe in that,on main passage that put a total stop on that is the theif on the crossin luke ,the massin the RC is exactaly what took place in exodus.here thomas i did some research on the development of the RC Errors, so here we go, Aprocryphal books were added to the bible(1546AD)- prayers for the dead(300AD) doctrine of 7 sacraments affirimed(1439AD), the Mass (394AD), WORSHIP MARY( 431 AD),Priest dress different(500AD) Purgatory( By prayerof Gregory the 1st.(600AD) the title of the pope given first to Boniface the 3rd. (607)Temporal power of pope given conferred by i thinks his name was depin or pepin King of france(750AD),Mass mandatory as a sacrifice and attend made mandatory(1st century).Thomas it sounds like you are more caughtin tradition than Scripture. In Gods word ( 1 corinthains 11:24- 25 the Lords supper is a memorial of Christ’s finished work,Do this in remembrane of me).scripture has athuority over the churchAll scripture is inspiried byGodand is profiable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for traingin righteousness(2 Timothy3;16).The church has no authority over scripture, thomas i not here to bash anyone cause i again am anx RC and was in catechism as a teen not the greatest student ,but there human ( wisdom) book does not line up with scripture and we alway need when we are dicussing or getting in to argument not to say screaming and yelling but in a mature manner we always have to answer questions in right context and go and see what Gods word has to say ,His word is infallable, inerrant,accurate and sufficient in all our lives situations andt rials and applications for us, there is only one translation,but could be variety of applications.

  • warrenoff

    You Stated that the euchurist is really Christ and that is found in page 1374-78 of the catechism paragrah),but Scripture(God’s Word) shows, A christain recieves jesus permanently spiritually in the heart.God put His spirit in our hearts as a guarantee(2 Corinthians1:22).there is no where in scripture that teaches purgatory if you believe in that here is a passage that totally put halt to purgatory(Luke23:42 and he was saying ( the thief on the cross that was rebuking the other thief on the cross)”Jesus, remember me when you come in You kingdom(heaven) verse 43 And He (Jesus) said to him” Truley I say to you , today you shall be with me in Paridise(Heaven). Not Purgatory .thomas take and read the bible and let it speak for it self.You said that you had a vision ,you know ,there is no were in scripture( in NT) that teaches us or shows us that anyone today has a visions or a proclamation( could say inspirations) from God only the prophets,and apostels had that gift(2 Peter1:20-21) and one today that they say has a Word from God is adding to His word and its clear in Revelation(22:18-19) plus Deuteronomy(4:2).(Proverbs 30:6 -Do no not add to His words Lest He reprove(in the hebrew Yakach means to be punished,to correct,to be convicted)you.andyou will be proved a liar>( (Deut12:32-What ever I command you shall be careful to do; you shall not add or take away from it).thomas I dont reason or debate on my own wisdom ,but through the God Word.As i know the canon closed at 66 books , there is no 67 th book. For this reason we also thank God with out ceasing, because, when you recieved the word of God which you have heard from us,you welcomed it not as the work of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which also affectively works in you who believe. (1 Thess 2:13). ( Ephesians 6:17 -And take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit which is the word God). Thomas you know Satan is very decieving and has many names accuser, liar, prince of theair,ruler of this world tempter, and Satan will pervert the truth,lead people to eternal death, control believers, solicit people to sin, it all here in Gods word. When people say they are followers of Christ and truely saved , the Holy Spirit come and reveals truth and the only way we can be taught and stay in total saturation and learning is be students of the word if we stop being in God word ,it is easy for the enemyto seep in is alway there.We defend error with the word of God.MY prayer for you and it is required in scripture to examine and see if we are truely are in the faith,test the spirits(1 john4:1-3)I encourage you thomas to read the of 1 john 1 to 5 )and -Paul here is saying thru the inspiritaion of the Holy Spirit. Eamine your selves as to weather you are in the faith.Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you? unless indeed you are disqualified.(2 Corinthains 13:5). cheers warren i know i will here from you Thomas P.M.B.

  • warrenoff

    Thomas you need to read romans were paul thru the inspirationof HS is showing us about our sinful state .( roman 3 :23 all have sinned and fallen short of the hlory of God,( rom 6:23) For the wages of sin is death,but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus. Here thomas you need to read here what paul is saying (Roman 2:10-18) verse 12 There is none who does good, no not one.I did not write the bible God did ,i just read with the Holy Spirit guidance and my theology and teachings from my pastor and the Holy Spirit showing him and all what God is showing and teaching ,and warning and sayinf ,yes He has Mercy . there are some earthly father who are not going to just sit around and watch his son or daughter do want ever destruction in there lives they want , if they do listen to there dad ,dad going to punish them,that does that mean dad does not love them? no dad want them not to keep messing up and dad will put consquences in there lives to help them not destroy them true genuine christain discipline is love. and that is what GOD did in the old tesament if you need to read time after time the Mercy and compassion and love God had on Israel ,but they rebelled , idolatry worship,sexuall sin and on and on , but a God in His love anf Mercey stretch out his hand and would restore them ,just for them to again go bach sinning ,but God did put some very serious and terifing circumstance in there paths and if you have read he did open up the earth and kill some and put diease on some and made them starve and eat there young and so on .why?(READ Roman 9:14-33 paul will show what God say on I will have compassion on whomever and i will have mercy on whomever. plur (READ Exodus 33:19-20 on whomeever Godwill be graciour on and compassion on).(TO DEMONSTRATE … HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS Roman 3:26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness that HE might be just and the Justifer of the one in faith,what that means is Through the incarnation.sinless life and substitutionary death of Christ.)( JUST AND THE JUSTIFIER.) The wisdom of God’s plan allows Him to punish Jesus in the place of sinners and thereby justify those who are guilty without compromising His justice. KEEPING YOU IN PRAYER THOMAS WARREN.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoff You wrote, “so thomas im a summing you are Roman catholic,you know that the Eucharist,,and the wine ,or grape juice some people ,take atcommuinion or the Lord’s Supper., is a symbol of Christ death and shedding of blood.the mass is the same thing as when mosses when he came down from the mount sini,as they all convince aron to gather all the gold to make the golden calfto worship God,it idoltary worship”You are assuming correctly and I cherish my Catholic Faith. This is not what Jesus said about what He did at the “Last Supper”, not even close!You then wrote, “about purgatory if you believe in that,”If there is a “purgatory, the difference between purgatory and hell is that those in purgatory know that they are getting out.You seem to have done a lot of studying about Scripture, I have met God.It doesn’t matter to me whether or not you believe that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus but you would be better off taking this up with the Holy Spirit since it was the Holy Spirit Who revealed this to me, remember what Jesus said about the Holy Spirit?Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoffYou wrote, “You Stated that the euchurist is really Christ and that is found in page 1374-78 of the catechism paragrah),”I stated that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus and that the Holy Spirit revealed this to me on 29 Jan 2000, it may very well be spoken of where you say in the catechism but it was the Holy Spirit Who revealed this to me, before that I did believe that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus but I did not know it.You also wrote, “A christain recieves jesus permanently spiritually in the heart.God put His spirit in our hearts as a guarantee”Jesus also says that if we don’t forgive we are not forgiven, as I have said, Jesus said a lot of things.You also wrote, “You said that you had a vision ,you know ,there is no were in scripture( in NT) that teaches us or shows us that anyone today has a visions or a proclamation”If you are referring to when I met God, I did not say I had a “vision”, I said I met God, God the Father and God the Holy Spirit and that the Holy Spirit revealed to me that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus and also that neither God the Father nor God the Holy Spirit said a word, didn’t have to.As far as “no were in scripture( in NT) that teaches us or shows us that anyone today has a visions or a proclamation”, maybe you should check out the Book of Revelation.You also wrote, “,but through the God Word.As i know the canon closed at 66 books ,”I am not sure of this but I think that it was during the reformation that books were deleted rather than that some were inserted.But the fact of the matter is that, in the bible, Jesus says, “Come follow Me”, He did not say follow the bible and furthermore when Jesus said this, there was no NT, as far as written down goes, anyway.You then wrote, ” cheers warren i know i will here from you Thomas P.M.B.”I thank you for the greeting and earlier you mentioned about my name, well Thomas Paul Baum is my given name and also my baptismal name and Moses is my confirmation name and even tho I was confirmed I think when I was 11, I have been called Moses since before I can remember.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoff Jesus asked us to forgive everyone an unlimited number of times, 7 X 7 or 70 X 7 does not mean 49 or 490 in this case, but unlimited, do you believe that God asked us to be more forgiving than God?Some people seem to think that God’s Mercy and Forgiveness is limited by us, do you?Who are we to tell God that God can only forgive within the limits that we “find” within the bible?Plenty of people try to confine God to the “box” that they construct out of their reading of the bible, whether anyone likes it or not, God is not confined by what is written in the bible, hopefully the bible can help lead some to God but God is not the bible and the bible is not God, God Is God and that is a Being of Pure Love.From the fact that God Is Love, all else flows which includes God’s Plan which is unfolding before our very eyes and God’s Plan is for ALL of God’s People and considering the fact that satan did not create anyone that means we are ALL GOD’S PEOPLE.This may or may not be true but there seems to be some that want Judgement and Justice for the other and Mercy and Forgiveness for themself.Justice and Mercy go hand in hand.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas been trying to respond ,but my comments are not going thru,mike gendron ministies, is a great resourcepage , it has helpped me,mike is anex RC and he has a passion for RC to see the differncr between the teaaching of the RC and there errors and what Gods woerd says .i encourage and pray for you to just listen what he has to say and listen to his testimonyhere it is . ww.pro-gospel.org talk soon warren

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas been trying to respond ,but my comments are not going thru,mike gendron ministies, is a great resourcepage , it has helpped me,mike is anex RC and he has a passion for RC to see the differncr between the teaaching of the RC and there errors and what Gods woerd says .i encourage and pray for you to just listen what he has to say and listen to his testimonyhere it is . ww.pro-gospel.org talk soon warren

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas,i had two comments typed ,but i lost it all ,i dont know what happen ,so i try again .in your comments you sais God is not the bible,and the bible is not God,where do you get that from?.it does not suprise me ,cause most RC dont believe in the truth of scripture(Gods word,the bible).listen to the bible speak ,Gods word from the that profound ,unbelieveable statement you just made(Hebrew 4:12-For the word of God is living and powerful and sharper than anytwo edged sword ,piercing to the division of soul and spirit ,and joint s and marrow and is the discernerof the thoughts and intent of the heart.and again(2 Timothy2 3:16-17) All Scripture not some ,but All Scripture is inspired by God( inspired is the greek word for God breathed,God spoke his word(the bible in to exsistence.comment on the Eurchrist in the wafer of bread is christ ,please send me to a passage in the bible so i can see thepassagethat is noly in the glossary of the RC terms ,with reference of the RC Catechismpag(1374,1378 man made teaching,Thomas not here to bash just let all the RC there march on there owen straight to hell in thier ignorance and pride ,it is very sad to see that ,cause i have friends and family doing just that( no one today wants to reason or read,or do there home work and this home work is very seriouus about eternal life or death. ,,if your going to defend the true God of the Holy Sacred Scriptures 66 Inspired (God breathed words of God thats where al answers questions are ,there is only one book on Truth in this Worlds and that is the suffiency, infallaibilty,accurate word THE Bible. If you dont be lieve in the last sentence, yourare decieving your selve and in a mademade ceter religion which i know cause i was there .Thomas i am praying for you ,cause when you say the HOLY Spirit ,revealed to you,and thenyou thru a statement out like God is not the Bible and the bible is not God wow what a contidiction.There is a passage in scripture that Gos states you arr eithere forMe or Against Me.Do not be partial ( a fence sitter as to say).well lets see if this go thru.cheers warrenoff,talk again.

  • warrenoff

    hey thomas i had some computor problems and typed some comments but never went thru ,will try again later,look again and read at (2 Timoyjt 3:16-17, and look at Hebrews 4:12-13,om ypur comment that God is not the bible and the bible is not God ,plir John1″1-5. cheers warrenoff

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoffYou wrote, “in your comments you sais God is not the bible,and the bible is not God,where do you get that from?.it does not suprise me”Are you serious? Either God Is or isn’t, a book about God is not God.You then wrote, “cause most RC dont believe in the truth of scripture(Gods word,the bible).listen to the bible speak”This is an absurd statement and also untrue. You then wrote, “For the word of God is living and powerful and sharper than anytwo edged sword ,piercing to the division of soul and spirit ,and joint s and marrow and is the discernerof the thoughts and intent of the heart”And WHO Is the “Word of God”, in case you don’t know Jesus is the “Word of God”, it is written right there in the bible, is it not?Then you wrote again, ” thenyou thru a statement out like God is not the Bible and the bible is not God wow what a contidiction”The bible is about God, the bible is not God, do you really think that the bible is God?By the way, God Is Love, Love is not an attribute of God but is God’s Very Being and all else flows from this fact including God’s Plan.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • warrenoff

    thomas ,the word inspired in the orginal greek means God breathed. because we have lots of english translations of the bible ,when we need to see a word or to under stand a passage ,weather in O.T. or N.T. We are suppose to go back to the oringal language of that time written to get the interpertation,just letting you know if you did not. thomas you say all humanity will be in heaven ,so let me understand that comment , correct me if i am wrong,if so sin can enter heaven?because if sin can enter in to paradise (heaven),that not heaven cause in your view all humanity is there ,can you show me that in the bible.second ,iwant to encourage you ,there is a ministry that has helpped me out very much on seeing how the doctrines of the RC,dont line up with Gods word,,His name is Mike gendron,a RC devout for 34 years,and thought he was on the right path till he say reading Gods ,word and praying and the Holy Spiritog God revealed to him,i just encourage you to listen and for put our pride and ignorance to the side like i did and here his testimony, i will be praying for you thomas,just here some of his insight that most Rc dont know about the truth of the RC false teachings ,.Even when you read martin luther he even seen the contridiction of the papacy and the councils in his time ,and that was on justifaction ,were the RC got that tacked on the wrong end,that another discussion..thomas to sum it up and we here are just doing circles in this discussion,its grace alone,faith alone Christ alone,in our instruction book,our compass, in Scripture alone. Most RCdont belive in the sufficincy of scripture or that they cherry pick,what suites them then reject other passage.God is going to be Glorified in two ways ,true genuine,sanctified.justified repenting ,called or elect,saved bible believing christains going to heaven, or the many who reject passages of scripture(Gods word) where Jesus taught about lot of humanity going to the place of abomination of desolation( hell),you cant deny scripture it there and we are going to stand in front of God and give a full account,even though he knows.God is Omniscience means God knows all of the heart of man,God knows ever thought second ,by second,ever since we came in to this world cause He knew us before the foundations of the world.,Omnipetence-God commanded ,created all things, rasied the dead,gave whole healthy bodies,forgavesin,pronounced judgement all developement of all omnipotence,Attributes of all Omnipresent -being everywhereat all times,ifHe desiredto be He said.there are passage after passage of His character.i have a question for you thomas who has more authority God word thru Scripture or you believe in the priest sor even better the pope and what he says and distributes thru the RC system teachings over what Gods word has to say? talk soon warrenoff

  • warrenoff

    yes the bible is voice of God,He has giving us a window to see Him and learn from Him and be warn from Him and taught, discipled ,and corrcts us ,on and on and on,the Rc is a manmade religionlike all of the religions out there trying to work or make browie points , but we dont have to do,that why he sent Him self down thru His word s spoken thru His human agents ,prophets or the ot and the apostles of the nt .(2 peter 1:19-22).we need to be taught the whole teaching of God word the Holy Sacred scripturesagain are instruction book,which seams thomas you dont believe in,is there but unless you are lead bty the sprirt you wont see Gods teaching .read 1Corinthains 2:10-16 and read romans on Gods justice,you need to read and stay away from made made religion.warrenoff

  • warrenoff

    thomas ,i am not here and will speak for other RC who have seen the truth and been coverted out of the false teaching of the RC,falsework religion.as otherfalse world religions ,not here to bash,i have heard from , my mom,amd RC friends,Jesus was very blunt , straight forward and ,stern to the religious leaders , of that time ,and is teaching is that HE is not going to tolerate,hardness of heart ,and pride,arogance,of thinkimg they,wre right with God and need not repent ,or start over thru grace ,or think they wree sinners,Jesus ,is doing what the father commanded Him even thought He(Jesus is the incarnate of God),it all there exspecially in the book of John.We dont need to bash ,we just let all the RC in there ignorance and pride march themselves straight in to the gates of Hell. i will always keep you in prayer thomas ,and you can defend your religion any way you seem fit,but God the Father( the judge of all) ,thru Jesus Christ ,of His Spirit will have the final word,God will saywhy did you not listen to what was writtem in my word,why did you add ,or tahe away,(proverd30:6 ;Deutoronomy 4:2 ;,and mostly Revealation 22:7 these are the words of Jesus(And behold I amcoming quickly. Blessed is he who heeds(listens) the words of the prophecy of this Book)Listen thomas in your state you said to me, are you serious ,either God is or isnt,a book about God is not God. remember God is Jesus ,Jesus is God and the Holy Spirit,they are same different in essence,dont twist God word,Jesus state ment in rev 22:7,,.Look at the passage of the transfiguration,Jesus on the mount ,talking to moses and Elijah,what did the peter and john see,basically God ,pstepped out of the Human flesh of jusus and revealed His God,Head,,the Shikina,light of the Living creator for a few secomds to talk ,His choosen ones ,that He spoke thru, where we see what He said thru what?His word ( the holy Sacred written word the bible.)thomas you alway end with take care be ready,i have answerd most of question thru the word of God,and you dont believe in the writtem word of God,how can you say your ready, and dont believe in yhe Bible written word od God.my prayer to you thomas believe in the writtem word of God,,repent of your sins and rejecting the written word of God,that is written in the bible,re-read rev 2:7 oner and over and praying for the spirit to reveal His truth in His wrtten word ,I and our church will keep you in prayer. warren

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoff You wrote, ” thomas you say all humanity will be in heaven”Actually, I look past heaven to the Kingdom, the new heavens and the new earth.You also wrote, “if so sin can enter heaven?Jesus took all of the sins of humanity upon Himself and He entered heaven, did He not?You then wrote, “,.Even when you read martin luther he even seen the contridiction of the papacy …”Do you know that Martin Luther most definitely believed that the Eucharist is Jesus and when some of the other “reformers” wanted him to denounce this belief of his, that he said no.You also wrote, “its grace alone,faith alone Christ alone,in our instruction book,our compass, in Scripture alone.”Doesn’t it say in “scripture” that “Faith without works is dead”?Are you saying that a “dead” faith is something that God smiles upon?You then asked, “.i have a question for you thomas who has more authority God word thru Scripture or you believe in the priest sor even better the pope and what he says and distributes thru the RC system teachings over what Gods word has to say?”My answer is Someone that you seem to have forgotten about, God.Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

  • ThomasBaum

    warrenoffYou wrote, “thomas ,i am not here and will speak for other RC who have seen the truth and been coverted out of the false teaching of the RC,”Considering that it was the Holy Spirit that revealed to me that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus, maybe you and some of the people that you follow should take this teaching of the Catholic Church up with the Holy Spirit.Considering that Jesus not only very specifically said, “This is My Body”, “This is My Blood”, not that it was a “symbol” and also that some at the time stopped following Jesus for this reason and Jesus did not back down from this being a “fact” not a “symbol”, you can either take it up with Jesus or with “scripture”, it is written plain as day.You then wrote, ” i will always keep you in prayer thomas ,and you can defend your religion any way you seem fit,”I appreciate your prayers but you should be praying for the “Will of God” just like Jesus taught us. As far as “defend your religion”, this is your opinion, I cherish my Catholic Faith and I do not consider it a religion.Prior to the year 2000 when God the Father came into my heart and God the Holy Spirit came into my body and revealed to me that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus, I, for the most part, did not go to church for approximately 30 years and looking back on it, after the fact, it seems as if one of the reasons is that it was becoming a “religion”.This does not mean that God was not working in my life, quite the contrary.Not only is it a relationship but I have met God not just learned about God from the bible.God can come to people in a multitude of ways, that is up to God how He does it.I have met God and I do not limit Him, God is God, I’m not, you seem to limit God by your knowledge of the bible.Do you have any idea why God’s Plan, written about in the bible, is referred to as “the mysterious Plan of God”?If the “wages of sin” is death and Jesus took the sins of the world upon Himself, do you think that He went thru more than just a “physical” death?Take care, be ready.Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.